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F-22在叙利亚羞辱Su-35,在对方附近用公共频道广播,对方完全发现不了,Su-35能看400KM的雷达对F22发现距离只有36KM......

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发表于 2017-6-17 17:42 | 只看该作者 回帖奖励 |倒序浏览 |阅读模式
作为美国最先进的战斗机,F-22“猛禽”最近很忙,5月5日,中新网报道,美国空军F-22战斗机在阿拉斯加拦截了俄罗斯图-95“熊”式战略轰炸机。6月14日,美国《航空周刊》杂志网站刊发文章《F-22如何在叙利亚上空“避免美俄冲突”》,文章中提到,利用F-22战斗机的隐身特性,美机能在不被对方发现情况下,实施威胁,从而达到“说服”俄机的效果。观察者网军事评论员表示,在这个时刻美媒隔空喊话,反映出在没有隐身第五代战斗机,又与美国紧张对峙的前提下,俄罗斯空军的窘境。


       

                               
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        (美国空军官网)F-22战斗机座舱特写


        《航空周刊》文章称, 一位美国空军F-22战斗机中队指挥官接受了该刊采访,应他的要求,文章中只透露他的呼号:“炮弹”(Shell),这位美国空军中校目前正指挥着一个中队的F-22“猛禽”战斗机,执行一项关键性的任务:避免叙利亚上空的美俄冲突。



        据报道,自2014年来,F-22战斗机就被部署到叙利亚执行作战任务,它执行了打击地面目标、为地面部队提供近距离空中支援,以及掩护传统战斗机不受地面防空火力威胁(观察者网:在叙利亚能对美军战机产生这样威胁的似乎只有叙利亚和俄罗斯“山毛榉”和S-400导弹了,这表明F-22在一定情况下可以扮演类似EF-18G“咆哮者”这类专业电子战飞机的角色)的各种任务。



        据报道,在4月6日美国用“战斧”导弹攻击叙利亚目标后,由于美俄空中对峙形势紧张,F-22开始“扮演美俄沟通的重要节点”,“炮弹”中校说,具体的方式则是让F-22战斗机用国际通用频道向对方喊话,“这种隐身战斗机在说服‘非联盟’的飞机合作方面有着独特的优势。”(观察者网注:“非联盟”飞机目前就是指俄罗斯和叙利亚空军飞机)



        报道说,F-22战斗机目前执行的任务包括充当空军的指挥控制飞机和高空情报搜集飞机,此外还能作为情报搜集和监视平台,甚至指挥和控制地面部队。但具备躲避雷达探测能力的F-22最独特的任务,还是“说服‘非联盟’飞机合作”。



        “如果你可以知道你需要说服的飞机在哪儿,而他根本看不到你,那么就很容易让它们知道制空权在谁手里,”,“炮弹”中校说:“如果他们根本找不到你,他们就会很不舒服,所以他们就会有压力按照你说的做。”



       

                               
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        冷战期间,在拌飞的时候到对手头上桶滚,这个动作在美军中有个专有名词“Flippin The Bird”,被认为是羞辱对手的做法


       

                               
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        当然,现在大家都知道,“最大美粉”的飞行员经常学习这种冷战先进经验


        随着美俄紧张局势升高,F-22执行此类任务的重要性日益提升。在“战斧”攻击后,莫斯科方面强烈指责美国,并终止了与美国在“降低冲突区”问题上的合作。



        但美国仍能和“非联盟”的飞机进行直接通讯,通过国际公认的非加密紧急通信频道,“炮弹”中校说F-22有点像四分卫(观察者网注:美式橄榄球中组织进攻的核心位置),它要通过高精度传感器确定战场上每个“演员”的位置,然后通过紧急频道告诉俄国人他们该往哪飞,以及要他们“让开路”。



        “炮弹”说,F-22能够飞进敌方控制区,进入敌人战斗机和防空系统的射程范围之内,而对方仍无法探测它的具体位置。因此空中优势就建立起来了——虽然允许对方自由飞行和地面行动,但却能产生足够的威慑力。



        “如果我们需要让他们知道我们因为某种原因来了,我们就让他们知道我们的位置——通常是威胁他们不要去干一些我们不想让他们干的事。”他说。



        在4月6日之后的几个星期里,“炮弹”和他的中队在一段时间内全部执行叙利亚上空的任务。除了“与‘非联盟’飞机沟通”——或者说就是威慑他们——之外,F-22执行了掩护友军部队的任务,包括驱赶可能轰炸友军部队的“非联盟”飞机,和为友军部队压制地面防空火力,偶尔他们还执行对地打击行动。



        他表示,与“非联盟”飞机的互动都很“专业”,并且补充说,他的中队没有遇到任何“值得他们抬抬眼皮”的事情。



       

                               
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        俄军在叙利亚部署了苏-35S战斗机,尽管该机电子设备号称达到“五代机标准”,但因为没有隐身性能,面对F-22的时候并没有什么区别


       

                               
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        根据美媒之前的推算,俄罗斯苏-35的雷达就算能在400公里距离上发现1平方米雷达反射面积的目标,实际探测F-22的距离也只有36公里,如果是实战,苏-35早就被击落了


       

                               
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        事实上苏-35雷达的所谓400公里视距,是一种特殊的工作模式下才能达到的性能,使用这一功能的时候,需要有预警机或其他手段提供的目标位置信息,然后苏-35的火控雷达对这个而距离上的目标进行精确测定,用来引导超远程空空导弹,换言之,它并不能提高苏-35搜索F-22的能力


        在导弹打击事件两个月后,“炮弹”所属中队开始恢复在伊拉克上空执行部分任务。他们的飞机表现“毫无瑕疵”,即使是在那些设计时没有考虑到的任务中也是一样,例如近距离空中支援,“炮弹”说,到5月28日,“猛禽”战斗机已经执行了1150个架次的任务,其中497次是近距离对地支援,自2014年以来,已经发射了1572件武器。



        在近距离对地支援任务重,F-22的表现一样超过所有其他飞机,不管是F-15E、B-52还是A-10。“炮弹”说,长期以来,A-10的30毫米加特林机关炮的咆哮声总是引起人们的注意,但F-22使用精确制导小型炸弹,例如GBU-32,作战效果明显超过了它。“炮弹”中校说,这种小型精确制导炸弹能够有效降低平民伤亡,同时降低对攻击区内建筑物的不必要破坏。



        尽管F-22能够很好的执行近距离对地支援任务,但它毕竟和A-10这样专门执行这个任务的飞机不一样——对于战区指挥官来说,F-22只是多了一件能够用来完成任务的工具。



        总体来说,F-22的首要任务依然是空中优势。



       

                               
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        一边是叙利亚被F-22羞辱,一边T-50却无法入役,即使勉强去了叙利亚,结果可能依然因为隐身性能差被羞辱——真是大写的尴尬


        “我们的地面部队自从1953年4月15日以后没有遭到过空中攻击,这是因为美国空军能够统治天空(观察者网注:原文如此,越战期间越南空军的‘查铺查理’大概是被‘选择性遗忘’了)。”他说,“而在现在的叙利亚,F-22就意味着制空权。”



        观察者网军事评论员认为,这篇充斥着洋洋得意味道的文章中,至少透露出一点,就是F-22作为一种高度隐身的战斗机,在叙利亚上空给俄罗斯空军带来了巨大的压力,原本为对抗F-22而开发的T-50战斗机“难产”至今,无法按计划发挥作用,而几年前到处吹嘘的各种“反隐身”技术“脑洞”在叙利亚上空也被证实全是虚妄。一边是俄罗斯媒体自吹苏-35的雷达探测距离400公里,能远距离发现F-22,另一边则是F-22用公用频道嘲笑苏-35战斗机是“睁眼瞎”。还偶尔通过开关弹舱或者其他手段,在俄罗斯人雷达上“闪现”一下,简直是“花样戏耍”。



        在这种情况下,只有一种与F-22具备同等隐身性能,能与之堂堂正正对抗的飞机才能压制对手的气焰——然而现在俄罗斯没有这样一种飞机,只能任由美国人羞辱。



        不过对于中国人来说,幸好。6月14日,山西北部上空,歼-20战斗机以五机编队密集飞行,可能为今年晚些时候某重大礼仪活动进行彩排。



       

                               
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        6月16日,网上出现照片,歼-20战斗机5机编队飞行。它是目前世界上唯一能与F-22媲美的隐身战机

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沙发
发表于 2017-6-17 17:51 | 只看该作者
珠海航展上PUPU说歼20和10b厂内对抗,18公里内歼10B才发现歼20。这应该是一回事吧。
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板凳
发表于 2017-6-17 17:55 | 只看该作者
大风起兮 发表于 2017-6-17 17:51
珠海航展上PUPU说歼20和10b厂内对抗,18公里内歼10B才发现歼20。这应该是一回事吧。

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地板
发表于 2017-6-17 18:00 | 只看该作者
有点牛逼啊,对毛子飞行员刺激太大了,成了恐怖游戏
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51
发表于 2017-6-17 18:01 | 只看该作者

幸亏有黑丝

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61
发表于 2017-6-17 18:15 | 只看该作者
不是同一档次的东西
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71
发表于 2017-6-17 18:28 | 只看该作者

坐等普沙皇360度裸体跪求全套引进废材31

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81
发表于 2017-6-17 18:29 | 只看该作者

前一阵鼓吹苏35如何强大的可以去自裁了,还有8个鸡巴院士可以枪毙了,连带那个左冷禅一起,如果没有ED大师,如今的土鳖如何是好

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91
发表于 2017-6-17 18:32 | 只看该作者

黑丝才是真正的镇国重器,而不是那个千年的鸡巴和难产的中秋

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101
发表于 2017-6-17 18:34 | 只看该作者

就废材31那小短腿,大毛不会要废材31的,更有可能的是放大版

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111
发表于 2017-6-17 18:36 | 只看该作者

那就放大一圈,改名废材62

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121
发表于 2017-6-17 18:38 | 只看该作者

普沙皇表示俺们的杀手锏是核弹而不是苏35

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131
发表于 2017-6-17 18:38 | 只看该作者

原文下面的网友互喷也很有意思,翻译不过来了,有兴趣的可以看看

http://aviationweek.com/defense/ ... erations-over-syria

Aviation Week & Space Technology

How F-22 Is Deconflicting U.S.-Russia Operations Over Syria

Jun 14, 2017 Lara Seligman | Aviation Week & Space Technology

“Shell” was just days into his first deployment to U.S. Central Command (Centcom) when U.S. Navy destroyers launched a surprise strike against the Syrian regime, pummeling Shayrat Airfield with dozens of Tomahawk cruise missiles.

In the tense wake of the attack, Shell, a U.S. Air Force lieutenant colonel and Raptor squadron commander who spoke on the condition that Aviation Week identify him only by his call sign, and his squadron of stealth F-22 Lockheed Martin Raptors had a critical job to do: deconflict coalition operations over Syria with an irate Russia.

The U.S.-led campaign against the Islamic State in Iraq and Syria has leaned heavily on the air-superiority fighter since its debut there in 2014. The F-22, originally designed as an air-to-air platform, has become crucial to the fight, regularly striking ground targets, providing close air support (CAS) for soldiers in battle, and protecting legacy strike fighters from surface and air threats.

   Spotlight on the F-22 in Operation Inherent Resolve

* After the April 6 Tomahawk strikes on Shayrat, the Raptor provided a crucial communications node between U.S. and Russian air forces;

* Shell and his squadron of F-22s talked to noncoalition players over an an internationally recognized frequency often used for aircraft emergencies

* The stealth aircraft had a unique advantage in getting noncoalition forces to cooperate

* The F-22 also regularly provides CAS, defensive counter-air, and ground strikes in the area of responsibility

But one of the most critical missions the F-22 conducts in the skies over Syria, particularly in the weeks following the April 6 Tomahawk strike, is deconfliction between coalition and noncoalition aircraft, says Shell.

Of course, the F-22 is not the only asset deconflicting the crowded skies over Centcom. The Air Force’s airborne command-and-control aircraft and high-altitude intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance platforms, as well as ground-based command-and-control forces, are also helping clear the area. But the stealth F-22’s ability to evade detection gives it a unique advantage in getting noncoalition players to cooperate, says Shell.

“It is easier to bring air dominance to bear if you know where the other aircraft are that you are trying to influence, and they don’t know where you are,” says Shell. “When other airplanes don’t know where you are, their sense of comfort goes down, so they have a tendency to comply more.”

Lockheed Martin’s stealth F-22 Raptor made its combat debut over Syria in September 2014. Credit: U.S. Air Force

The F-22 provided a crucial communications node when tensions between the U.S. and Russia were running high. Following the Tomahawk strikes, Moscow condemned the attack and suspended the so-called “deconfliction line” the two countries used to coordinate air operations over Syria. U.S. President Donald Trump said relations with Russia were at an “all-time low.”

But U.S. and noncoalition aircraft were still communicating directly, over an internationally recognized, unsecure frequency often used for emergencies known as “Guard,”  says Shell. His F-22s acted as a kind of quarterback, using high-fidelity sensors to determine the positions of all the actors on the battlefield, directing noncoalition aircraft where to fly and asking them over the Guard frequency to move out of the way.

The Raptors were able to fly in contested areas, in range of surface-to-air missile systems and fighters, without the noncoalition players knowing their exact positions, Shell says. This allowed them to establish air superiority—giving noncoalition forces freedom of movement in the air and on the ground—and a credible deterrent.

“If we need to let them know that we are there for any reason, then we will let them know that we are there—usually to deter something that they are trying to do that we don’t want them to do,” he explains.

During those weeks after April 6, Shell and his squadron temporarily moved all of their operations into Syria. In addition to helping deconflict and deter noncoalition actors, the F-22s also provided defensive counter-air for allied forces on the ground and in the air, and occasionally conducted ground strikes and CAS, Shell says.

He stresses that the interactions with noncoalition aircraft were always “professional,” adding that his squadron experienced “nothing that raises any eyebrows.”

Two months after the strikes, Shell’s squadron is back to splitting its time between Iraq and Syria. The aircraft is performing “immaculately,” even in  mission sets it was not built for, such as CAS, Shell says. As of May 28, the Raptor had conducted 1,150 sorties, including 497 CAS sorties, and employed 1,572 weapons since the beginning of Operation Inherent Resolve in 2014, according to the Air Force.

In the CAS role, the F-22 augments the platforms already conducting that mission in the region, such as the F-15E, the B-52 bomber and the A-10, Shell says. While the A-10 is renowned for the roar of its 30-mm Gatling gun and its long loiter time, the F-22 brings precision-guided munitions (PGM) such as the GBU-32 and Small-Diameter Bomb. PGMs significantly reduce civilian casualties and potential damage to buildings and other structures in the area, Shell points out.

Although the F-22 can perform CAS well, it is not built for that role as is the A-10— it is just another tool combatant commanders can use to complete the mission, Shell stresses.

Overall, the most important thing the Raptor brings to the OIR fight is air superiority, Shell says.

“Our ground troops have not been attacked from the air since April 15, 1953, and that is because of the U.S. Air Force providing air dominance,” he adds. “The F-22 is the primary provider of air superiority in Operation Inherent Resolve.”

-----以下为老外喷子互掐-------------------------------

Discuss this Article 103

bernard@f-max.nl
on Jun 14, 2017

I still struggle to believe that the F22 is as stealthy as claimed. Any jet emits lots of hot air - facilitating IR detection at large distances - at least if it's flying high and if there's LOS to the detector. I know that the exhaust gasses are cooled down to reduce detectability, but come-on, it's not a candle that we're trying to spot on the surface of the moon,,, Furthermore, RF stealth can't operate effectively across a broad RF spectrum. Thirdly, using a nonsecure radio link would - at least in theory - allow for accurate triangulation, albeit only during brief communication intervals. This would however greatly aid subsequent IR and radar detection and blow the cover.
“F22有个鬼隐身性啊,发动机尾气那么热,红外信号远远就看见了啊”

skyefire@skyefi...
on Jun 14, 2017

IR radiation doesn't propagate through atmosphere nearly as well as RF, making its utility fall off rapidly with distance.
In the RF spectrum, it's true that LO tech can't cover the entire range. But it's also true that different frequencies are more militarily useful than others -- stealth against ELF, for (deliberately ridiculous) example, would be utterly useless. It only makes sense to concentrate your defenses against the enemies' strengths.
The potential downside is that LO technology (as implemented currently in the F-22 and F-35, at least) is such a core part of the airframe design that expanding or shifting the RF range it's most effective against will be difficult, at best. And anyone looking to produce sensors effective against 5th-gen aircraft is sure to be pushing hard to find ways to find new utility in frequencies that those aircraft are weak(er) against.
On the emissions side, while any emission can *in theory* be tracked, emitting in brief bursts using spread-spectrum techniques can make any such detection and tracking substantially more difficult. On the other hand, there's a never-ending drive in R&D to find better ways to more reliably pick such fragmentary signatures out of the background noise.
In the end, invisibility isn't the point -- making the adversary's job *harder* is. Whether the F-22 (and F-35, soon) accomplish that sufficiently to justify their cost and development time... remains to be seen. The F-22's recent performance is certainly a positive sign, but it's hardly an "acid test" against anything resembling a (near?) peer opponent.
Perhaps the best thing to come out of the F-22's use over Syria, so far, is actual working experience with the aircraft's capabilities and limitations in a real, if rather low-tier, threat environment.
“红外信号在大气层里传不了那么远啊,布啦啦啦,反正F22和F35就是好啊就是好”

vkess1
on Jun 14, 2017

"anyone looking to produce sensors effective against 5th-gen aircraft is sure to be pushing hard to find ways to find new utility in frequencies that those aircraft are weak(er) against." Isn't that in itself enough utility? Insightful post.
(大概意思是“楼上SB”)

bernard@f-max.nl
on Jun 14, 2017

Good points and a valuable post skyefire. I'm certainly not an expert on IR detection techniques. Nevertheless, I do know that telescopes can detect a candle on the surface of the moon - from the surface of the earth right through Earth's atmosphere. That's not many photons to work with. Surely, clouds or fog or a dust storm will all prevent IR detection, so any detector has to be mounted above the clouds to detect high-flying targets (and on the ground for low-flying targets). Detectors in the sky cannot have the size / aperture and hence sensitivity and resolution of a ground-based telescope / array of telescopes. Still it's had to believe that a good sensor (array) cannot detect a "stealth" plane at a distance of tens of miles under clear sky conditions...
(“我不是业内专家,但比你强多了”的意思)

Usurper1
on Jun 14, 2017

A good sensor probably CAN detect the presence a stealth aircraft from tens of miles.
What NOW?


OneLandingforev...
on Jun 16, 2017

In exercises -- where aircraft have modern IR sensors -- the F-22 and F-35 are simply not seen or are seen too late.
The first warning that enemy aircraft will have that the F-22 or F-35 are in the neighborhood will be when their wingman blows up. That is a bit late.
演习的时候,别的飞机都无法(及时)发现F22、F35的


RedStatePatriot
on Jun 16, 2017

Not sure I get your point or question.... what now. Well, since a non-stealth opponent can be detected and tracked WAY further I suppose what now is the stealthy aircraft will destroy that target before he is in range.


Usurper1
on Jun 16, 2017

Yep... That's the point i was getting at.
Sounds like you got it after all.


wmarsh73
on Jun 16, 2017

Well, if it's a 'hot' environment, if your detection equipment cannot locate the plane until it is within tens of miles of it, I'd say your detection equipment (and the people manning it) would first detect the incoming missile from the F-22 or F-35 before they 'see' the plane that launched it. They would live a brief but exciting existence in the moments before missile impact. At least that's the 'theory' anyways.


dukeofurl
on Jun 16, 2017

And how does the F-22 or F-35 track the target before launching the missile ? They dont as far as im aware use IRST so they must have a radar to 'see anything', or the other plane is all lit up in RF ?
Meanwhile European and Russian fighters do have IRST which will see the F-22 at long range- its cold up at high altitude and leading edges will heat up even at reasonable speeds.
"“In theory, state of the art IRST could find and track F-22 at quite long range,”- RUSI


Triggertreats
on Jun 16, 2017

"I do know that telescopes can detect a candle on the surface of the moon"

– That's not true, as everyone knows that candles cannot work on the moon, on account of there being no oxygen to burn.

– If your point is that telescopes can detect a light source that's equal to the luminosity of a candle from that distance, that's still a false equivalence. Your telescopes still need to know exactly where to look in the first place in order to spot that light source. They can't look at the moon as a whole and discern that light source. They either have to know ahead of time where to focus into, or they have to spend a great amount of valuable time scanning the entire surface of the moon. Earth's atmospheric disturbances can make that task more difficult (that's why Hubble is in orbit, and even in the case of Hubble, it has to keep it's "shutter" open for a while, letting light build up in its CCD over time in order to build images)


DanR
on Jun 16, 2017

The earths atmosphere from ground level to space has an equivalent thickness to 8km of air at sea level. Slant ranges for IR detection from the ground are highly compromised due to this detail. This is also why mounting telescopes on mountains happens.

Secondly IR spectrum are not absorbed at the same intensity, it is possible to use coatings to shift your emissions to frequencies which are heavily absorbed.

That said I expect that I won't be too long before we see stealth being applied to electric/solar powered aircraft along the lines of the Quintiq/Facebook aircraft, they would be exceedingly difficult to detect by any means IR or radar.


Rob
on Jun 17, 2017

I struggle to accept that any telescope can detect a candle on the moon when even the Hubble telescope in orbit has a minimum arc resolution of 4 meters at that range.


richard_krebs@t...
on Jun 16, 2017

Hence the need for HARM


Felix A9
on Jun 16, 2017

The new model with the bigger motor and designed for internal carriage. Of course it will never be built as that would make too much sense.


mikeBFM
on Jun 16, 2017

@skyefire
This is the most useful and "best" post I have read on "Aviation Week" since I started to read the comment section. (And I am reading it for quite a while)


mark.garcia.986...
on Jun 15, 2017

It's called technology. We really do have the best.


projob66
on Jun 16, 2017

I agree with your "hot air" comment. Seems to be going around a lot lately.


JimmyD
on Jun 16, 2017

"stealth" isn't magic or a cure-all. It's a capability, like speed, altitude or maneuverability. Each has it's value relative to your opposition.


Usurper1
on Jun 16, 2017

Very well said. And still not well grasped by the vast majority of people out there... Who assume that because a stealth fighter is tracked, it means the stealth tech is a failure... Which of course is as silly as saying that if you cant outrun a mach 6 missile, then your aircraft's engine tech is a failure.


Jack LaBonte
on Jun 16, 2017

Come on. Transmissions on standard Guard freqs are going through some sort of TDRS space system or local spoofing repeater, not a 5 inch antenna on the aircraft. Maybe it's a grunt on the ground with a frequency hopping super cell phone but it sure as heck is not coming from the F-22 itself.


musha
on Jun 16, 2017

Question is, are Russians aware that they were guarded by hidden F22 in the sky or whole this story is hoax to boost US morale in Syria?


Eugeniojoe@aol.com
on Jun 14, 2017

This story smells of overt propaganda, nothing stealthy about it.


RedStatePatriot
on Jun 16, 2017

I suspect the "propaganda" is what the Voices in your head are telling you.


aztecf15@gmail.com
on Jun 14, 2017

E+10: it is abundantly evident to me that you are not a fighter pilot with even minor credibility. So, you just keep on thinking those ill-lucid thoughts.


peterjpeirano@m...
on Jun 14, 2017

If it emits anything, from RF to IR, it can be detected. May be unknown, but it is detected.


cliff@ransomres...
on Jun 14, 2017

"Deconflicting?" Is that the new politcally-correct word for "Scaring the blazes out of your adversaries?"


wmarsh73
on Jun 16, 2017

It's the polite term for raising their 'pucker factor'


EoG787
on Jun 16, 2017

No, it's the word that pilots use for preventing mid-air collisions. Deconflicting can occur by flight level, vector, and time. This a normal part of air operations.


JDDrouin
on Jun 16, 2017

Yes. Not nearly as colorful as "Flvck with the bull and you get the horn", but these are the times we live in.


Bronco Dunebuster
on Jun 14, 2017

IR detection is very short range capability from ground positions. In the air it tends to be forward dection, and not 360 perimeter capable. Haven't seen much in print about any major defense contractor selling ground equipment for exhaust detection.


m_5teve
on Jun 14, 2017

If BAE+ are working on jamming kits that can detect then generate opposing waves in real time to counter enemy radars across a wide spectrum, why would we need stealth going forward? Wouldn't this jamming capability be more effective, operationally and economically?


Usurper1
on Jun 14, 2017

Seeing as the more wattage you pump into the air to jam, the larger target you become, why not reduce the amount of energy even needed to jam... That's the beauty of stealth.
Stealth and jamming go together.


RedStatePatriot
on Jun 16, 2017

It's not "either or" really, one complements the other. You want to be as hard to see as a baseline configuration and then add the confusion of jamming, decoying, and spoofing on top of that. being as hard a target as you can make yourself is always good.


mjcarew@att.net
on Jun 15, 2017

The F-22 can be "detected" but t is gone B 4 any action can be taken against it. Any emissions from an aircraft can be detected if jamming isn't present. Stealth & jamming by F-22 and F-35 ltr will dominate any skies. Jamming is always present when air combat is used in conflicted air space or ground defense areas.


jam44-44@comcast.net
on Jun 15, 2017

Boeing's suggested (new gen) F-18 E/F/Growler are not stealthy however the Jammer/Emitters Can be tracked. That is why the stealth a/c & Growlers do not go in together.


RedStatePatriot
on Jun 16, 2017

They DO work together... F18G's don't have to be all that close to the enemy air defenses to jam, they can stay at stand off distances and aid the more stealthy aircraft going in too attack.


metuna@earthlink.net
on Jun 15, 2017

Shell and his squadron of F-22s talked to noncoalition players over an an internationally recognized frequency often used for aircraft emergencies

So it talks to other noncoalition players on a radio..WOW


Crabble
on Jun 16, 2017

The description is entirely accurate. Not sure what you are upset about.

RedStatePatriot
on Jun 16, 2017

I guess your lower IQ level does not let you understand the focus of the article... if you thought it was that the F22 can use a common frequency (and apparently that's what you got form the story) then you should stick to reading comic books, and leave these conversations to the adults.


musha
on Jun 16, 2017

R u getting paid for leaving offensive comments after each post? Or the clearly hoax story makes you excited?


TheSandbagger
on Jun 16, 2017

And the F-35, which we are told is "operational", sits idle, with Air Force pilots not even able to take it to an air show.


D.Monty
on Jun 16, 2017

The USAF only has one operational squadron for now. They just did a mini-deployment to Europe. You can only do so much when the aircraft is still coming off the assembly line...


TheSandbagger
on Jun 16, 2017

The 34th has been "operational" for nearly a year, so the excuse is pretty lame. There are far more F-35s than the entire production run of F-22s, although they are useless prototypes, umm, "development" aircraft. Yes, you can do only so much with aircraft that are out-classed by 30-year old aircraft that they are supposed to replace. A lot of talk about how great the Wundercraft is supposed to be, but no one would trust flying it anywhere near a potential combat zone. ALL of the aircraft coming off that assembly line will need to be modified.


MNIce
on Jun 16, 2017

The "modification" is on the same order as the one Microsoft tries to do to every Windows 8 system (change it to Windows 10). Even if a major hardware change is needed, that is nothing new; airlines do it all the time whenever there is an AD out on their aircraft. That doesn't imply it's a bad aircraft.

By the way, your information about being "outclassed by 30-year old aircraft that they are supposed to replace" is out of date. The initial trials that sparked that legend were done with developmental aircraft that had deliberately limiting software installed because the full flight envelope had not yet been cleared. The F-35 is a very complex aircraft, with a number of unusual features. Because there is so much to be tested, and it would have been unsafe to have interference with some of the untested features while others were being tested, those not being tested yet were intentionally kept off line. F-35s with initial operating capability software, not yet up to full specifications, were still able to clean the clocks of entire squadrons of F-16s last year, with a better than 15:1 win ratio.


Triggertreats
on Jun 16, 2017

IOC (Initial Operating Capability) was reached last year.

IOC is the point in time during the Production & Deployment (PD) Phase where a system can meet the minimum operational (Threshold and Objective) capabilities for a user’s stated need. The operational capability consists of support, training, logistics, and system interoperability within the DoD operational environment. IOC is a good gauging point to see if there are any refinements needs before proceeding to Full Operational Capability (FOC).

Full Operational Capability (FOC) is when a system is delivered to a user and they have the ability to fully employ and maintain it to meet an operational need. The mission capabilities of a FOC system are defined in a system’s Capability Development Document (CDD) and Capability Production Document (CPD).

IOC isn't the "finish line," it's just another milestone.


DanW
on Jun 16, 2017

Uh....better read up on that. The Marines are forward deploying to Japan. The Air Force has their squadron quite busy learning about how to employ the aircraft, and guess what? It is going to the Paris Air Show.

Maybe they don't want our potential adversaries getting too close a look at it just yet in a combat zone. Why do that when the F-22 can do the job with stealth that is a few steps behind the F-35?
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141
发表于 2017-6-17 18:40 | 只看该作者

大胆,明明是9院士,居然无视孙-诺夫-聪。。。。。。

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151
发表于 2017-6-17 18:46 | 只看该作者
如果这是真的,那是秒杀的代差了。Su35可以不隐身,但必须能够在同等距离上发现对方、攻击对方,这样的话这雷达要比对方强一个量级才行,这可能吗?
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161
发表于 2017-6-17 18:51 | 只看该作者
这就叫代差
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171
发表于 2017-6-17 18:55 | 只看该作者

F-22真有那么牛的话,毛子飞行员背上全是冷汗啊

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181
发表于 2017-6-17 18:57 | 只看该作者

幸好我鳖已有J20,全国人民都要感谢杨伟和成飞

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191
发表于 2017-6-17 18:59 | 只看该作者

孙聪诺夫,顾诵芬斯基

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201
发表于 2017-6-17 19:06 | 只看该作者
大萝卜 发表于 2017-6-17 18:46
如果这是真的,那是秒杀的代差了。Su35可以不隐身,但必须能够在同等距离上发现对方、攻击对方,这样的话这雷达要比对方强一个量级才行,这可能吗?

不好意思,刚才随手一写写错了,距离差一个量级,雷达功率得至少两个量级。
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